various filters

[theschmotone]

[voice][public]

I gots an open qvestion for de netvork: vhat does "honor" mean to hyu? Iz it de same or different den "duty" or "loyalty"? Does hyu try to live "honorably", und vhat does dot involve?

[voice][private/moderate to hack]

De more dot I hears about vhat a samurai iz und does, de more I iz reminded of de Jagerkin. Loyalty to de Master or Mistress until death, und a few odder tings here und dere, make me very curious. Perhaps ve could learn a ting or two from dem, und dey from us. I gots to admit, though, dot I finds dis "honor" ting both fonny und confusing...

Comments

[find-my-truth.livejournal.com]

I think the three are separate, but very connected.

[voice]

[theschmotone.livejournal.com]

But how? Can hyu have vun or two vithout de odders, or iz all vun beeg package?

[notalfred.livejournal.com]

Hm...It's something to think about.

I think having honor would mean being loyal to those around you and to your duty, but it can also have other things along with that.

[causink-trouble.livejournal.com]

To dose around hyu?... Vot doez dot mean?

[fuhenteki.livejournal.com]

The idea of "honor" is completely subjective, meaning it is focused entirely upon the individual's sense of what honor is.

Some would say honor focuses upon 'pride' but the word pride can sometimes add a negative sense to the definition of honor.

[voice]

[theschmotone.livejournal.com]

Zo, iz different from vun person to de next? How can zomevun tell anodder person dot dey's not being honorable if iz all subjective?

[Voice]

[prettyflyguy.livejournal.com]

To me, "honor" is... Well, I guess I'd describe it as the good morals within someone, something to be protected and fought for. It's different than "duty," which I think is more an obligation to oneself and one's country and not necessarily something from the heart.

"Loyalty," though... I think of "loyalty" as an attachment, swearing one's self to something and sticking by it no matter what. I never gave thought to living "honorably," but I'm sure that'd involve staying true to yourself, honest and just. Not running away from a fight, but not starting one, either.

Why do you ask?

[notalfred.livejournal.com]

I like your answer.

[Voice]

[theschmotone.livejournal.com]

Just vondering vhat odder pipple thought. I gots zome friends who's samurai, und vhen hyu's around dose kind of pipples, hyu can't help but tink about such tings from time to time.

Heh. Looks like I gots de "loyalty" und de "duty" down, but I doezn't tink dot I iz ever going to go much for honor, except vhen iz convenient.

[Voice]

[fatherofcute.livejournal.com]

I agree with your description of loyalty and duty! As for honor, I think it's having principles and beliefs and all that and sticking to it in and living life in a way that adheres to these, etc etc. For example, it would be so much easier to just kill all your enemies, but your honor dictates that mercy is a virtue worth upholding so you don't.

Often, duty and loyalty and honor get in the way of each other. In the army, I learned firsthand that duty will often make you do things to sully your honor. However, strictly adhering to duty is a form of keeping honor in itself!

[voice | public]

[causink-trouble.livejournal.com]

Now dot's interestink.

...
*mostly sounds like she's talking to herself trying to figure things out*
Loyalty iz eazy, und hyu doezn't need it explained. But since dis iz a public ting und all, Hy'll try. Hyu svears to somevun und hyu'z deirs, hyu does vot dey vants, or vot dey orders, or vot iz goot for dem. Dese three tings iz not alvays de same, und den tings gets complicated, but ve deals vit it somehow.

Duty iz like dot too, except iz only doink vot hyu'z told, not vot hyu tinks hyu should. Hyu can haff a duty cozz hyu'z loyal to somevun or someting, or cozz hyu'z gettink paid, or odder schtuff.

Honor is one ov dese complicated human vords... Iz different. *she sounds confused* Iz like loyalty to someting hyu just made op, but lots ov pipples makes up similar vuns. But hyu can't be loyal to two different tings, or pipples, so if Hy'z Jägerkin, Hy can't haff honor, not really. Ve can do some ov de honor tings, if ve vants. Iz often goot, cozz iz like not cheatink in games. Iz less fon if hyu cheats. But sometimes iz not, or hyu iz ordered to vin.

Doez Hy try? Sometimes, Hy suppoze. It sort ov makes sense. Hy likes my opponents to haff a chance in a fight - iz more interestink dot vay. Or let pipples see me und try to run before Hy kills dem. Dot kind ov ting. Now izn't dot veird? Oh, und dere's keepink hyu vord und dot kind ov schtuff. Dot's pretty simple.

*suddenly uncertain, clearly asking the network*
Does Hy gots dot right at all?

[voice | Dimo | medium hacking difficulty]

Hoy, Dimo, vot's vit all de tinking?

[voice][filtered to Jenka/moderate to hack]

[theschmotone.livejournal.com]

I just vonders about tings zometimes, und dis iz vun of dose tings dot I haz been tinking over. Being friends vith pipples like Gorobei und Kambei reminds me from time to time of odder friends back home, but dese samurai goes about tings different. Doezn't alvays make sense, zo I thought I vould ask odder pipples und zee vhat dey haz to zay.

I could ask hyu de same ting, hyu know. Dot's an awful lot of tinking hyu just did dere.

[Filtered to Dimo, also viewable to Kanna samurai]

[goromical.livejournal.com]

My duty is my honor, and my duty is my samurai code. Protecting those I care about. Loyalty is different. Loyalties change, but I've never stopped caring for the people who are important for me.

I try to live honorably given this definition, yes. I usually am successful.

[voice][filtered to Gorobei/moderate to hack]

[theschmotone.livejournal.com]

*stumbles, and is at a bit of a loss for words*

I...hyu know, of any of dese answers, de vun dot hyu just gave me makes de most sense.

Thenks.

voice;

[what-scruples.livejournal.com]

Your honor's only as good as your credit. At least in my line of work.

[Voice]

[theschmotone.livejournal.com]

Ha! Goot point! Vhat does hyu do?

[phytotoxin.livejournal.com]

Duty, Honour and Loyalty are usually unrelated, in my experience.

Somebody might have to perform a task as part of their duty, that they don't find honourable in the least. It might be somebody's duty to slay somebody, but they might find the act abhorrent, despite this.

Somebody might be loyal to somebody who doesn't share their ideals of honour, also. In this situation you may, like the previous, be forced to do something dishonourable for that person. It depends which comes out on top how you feel about it though. If your loyalty to them overrides the honour, it will win out and you'll do it anyway. If your honour doesn't allow you to do it despite your loyalty, well... you may need to reconsider that devotion.

It may also be your duty to do one thing, but you may be loyal to something else. For instance, you may be an Ivonian born person, on board an openly anti-Ivona ship, which you are attached to. What happens then? Do you keep to your duty and side with the ship, or do you stick with where your loyalties lie and side with Ivona?

The three shouldn't be confused, though sometimes they cross over. It all depends on circumstance.

I try and live honourably as far as one can in my line of work, yes. Luckily, I have no loyalties to interfere with this honour except to the Guild and my only duty is to uphold the honour of it.

[voice | filtered to Marluxia | hard to hack]

[causink-trouble.livejournal.com]

Und vot line ov vork vould dot be?

[Voice]

[theschmotone.livejournal.com]

I can zee dot I iz going to be doing a lot more tinking about dis--dose iz zome pretty deep tings to ponder.

[anthypants.livejournal.com]

The meaning of all three are subjective, and vary greatly depending on the views of a person.

'Honor' is a code of conduct, a formula of responses which follow the path of correct behavior and relations to other people as perceived by the individual.

'Duty' is an obligation, a series of actions one carries out because they believe they owe these to others.

'Loyalty' is the subjugation of one's self to an ideal or person. It places that thing above others in the consideration of the individual.

All three are either things that come voluntarily from inside a person, shaped by their own thoughts, or they can be predefined things that a person accepts from an outside source, and chooses to internalize.

Depending on the person, they can as rigid as a written set of legal rules, or they can be intangible ideals which are flexible and depend on the context of the situation.

[Voice]

[theschmotone.livejournal.com]

Vell den, I guess dot I gots honor of a sort going on, ja? I mean, if iz based on vhat I tink iz right, after all. I tink dot "loyalty" iz de big vun for me, though.

[filtered to Anthy/moderate to hack]

Und vhat about hyu, Miss Anthy? Does any of dem vords apply to hyu?

[nice-young-man.livejournal.com]

...I guess honor is the standards a person holds themselves to. While duty and loyalty can be based on honor, they aren't quite the same thing. Duty's more specific - it's more like the responsibilities a person has towards other people. As for loyalty, that's based more on emotion. It's how strongly a person feels about duty and honor towards those around them.

[Voice]

[theschmotone.livejournal.com]

Zo mebbe honor iz more for hyuzelf, und duty iz how hyu show dot to odders?

[zack-thefairest.livejournal.com]

Interesting question you're asking!

It's not the same thing. Honor is more personal, duty and loyalty are generally towards others.

[Voice]

[theschmotone.livejournal.com]

Honor's de ground dot hyu builds on, und de odder two vhat hyu does vith de house vhat hyu builds on dot ground?